Hamilton Tiger-Cats

[OV Argo]

Only one was a designed run. The rest were extended/broken plays.

Allen is also bigger, stronger, and thicker than Ford, not to mention less injury prone. According to NFL Next Gen stats, Allen's game speed is faster than his 4.75 combine time, and I don't buy he's a 4.75 guy.

You, like your little buddy you like to defend here, don't get / can't grasp the point - which simply is, that a mobile, run threat QB can be a real plus for a football offence; it doesn't have to be a lot of designed run plays (and you don't know if Allen had a big green light option on any of those carries last night), and it doesn't matter if some of it is off broken plays. Tracy Ham may have had all sorts of run plays and calls that gave him the option to take-off, and he did pass way more than he carried the ball, but his scrambling and running ability made him a very good and successful CFL QB. Russ Jackson, Doug Flutie, Damon Allen were all obviously not just running QBs, but that skill helped make them even better than their fine passing arms alone allowed; same deal with Nathan Rourke (one of the top running QBs in all of US college ball in his days there), Chad Kelly or Cody Fajardo in the CFL now (Davis Alexander sort of too, but has the nagging hamstring injury concern to limit him there)

Josh Allen is a bigger, thicker body QB vs. Tre Ford but he is also being chased by some bigger D-linemen and LBs compared to Ford and also playing on a much smaller, tighter playing surface; Ford is also plain way faster (wether you like that or not) and gets to motor on a much bigger playing surface. There are numerous other very mobile, run threat QBs playing in the NFL now. Teams don't just have to have one of those ability QBs, but to ignore or dismiss or be blind to what that type of QB can do for an offence = i don't get it ??? Groovy though, if you believe pure pocket passing QBs are better and preferable

QBs could get injured by choosing to run; just like all sorts of more immobile QBs get injured just sitting in the pocket.

Pretty simple concepts, but disagree all you like.

Ford has always run a lot and continues to do so but he can't be doing that every play. He has to have the ability to sit in the pocket, go through his reads, and deliver the football.

For sure - maybe some CFL GOB offensive mind can make him into a great pocket passer like Jake Maier, while ignoring his mobility /run threat.

[ArgoRavi]

You, like your little buddy you like to defend here, don't get / can't grasp the point - which simply is, that a mobile, run threat QB can be a real plus for a football offence; it doesn't have to be a lot of designed run plays (and you don't know if Allen had a big green light option on any of those carries last night), and it doesn't matter if some of it is off broken plays. Tracy Ham may have had all sorts of run plays and calls that gave him the option to take-off, and he did pass way more than he carried the ball, but his scrambling and running ability made him a very good and successful CFL QB. Russ Jackson, Doug Flutie, Damon Allen were all obviously not just running QBs, but that skill helped make them even better than their fine passing arms alone allowed; same deal with Nathan Rourke (one of the top running QBs in all of US college ball in his days there), Chad Kelly or Cody Fajardo in the CFL now (Davis Alexander sort of too, but has the nagging hamstring injury concern to limit him there)

Josh Allen is a bigger, thicker body QB vs. Tre Ford but he is also being chased by some bigger D-linemen and LBs compared to Ford and also playing on a much smaller, tighter playing surface; Ford is also plain way faster (wether you like that or not) and gets to motor on a much bigger playing surface. There are numerous other very mobile, run threat QBs playing in the NFL now. Teams don't just have to have one of those ability QBs, but to ignore or dismiss or be blind to what that type of QB can do for an offence = i don't get it ??? Groovy though, if you believe pure pocket passing QBs are better and preferable

QBs could get injured by choosing to run; just like all sorts of more immobile QBs get injured just sitting in the pocket.

Pretty simple concepts, but disagree all you like.

Ford has always run a lot and continues to do so but he can't be doing that every play. He has to have the ability to sit in the pocket, go through his reads, and deliver the football.

For sure - maybe some CFL GOB offensive mind can make him into a great pocket passer like Jake Maier, while ignoring his mobility /run threat.

His mobility threat has never been ignored in the CFL.

[ArgoRavi]

also watching the Tabbies getting thumped at home, and cannot help noticing how utterly
down and depressed McManis looks out there.
Especially now in 4th Qtr. when Hamilton D is tiring, from being on the field so much.

I too noticed how frustrated McManis looked. He was probably thinking that he shouldn't have left the Argos.

[argolio]

Watching any of the Bills game tonight? - with Josh Allen running often to great affect? - guess the Bills didn't get your football/QB expert memo about how running QBs have no place in the pro game ?

Only one was a designed run. The rest were extended/broken plays.

Allen is also bigger, stronger, and thicker than Ford, not to mention less injury prone. According to NFL Next Gen stats, Allen's game speed is faster than his 4.75 combine time, and I don't buy he's a 4.75 guy.

You, like your little buddy you like to defend here, don't get / can't grasp the point - which simply is, that a mobile, run threat QB can be a real plus for a football offence; it doesn't have to be a lot of designed run plays (and you don't know if Allen had a big green light option on any of those carries last night), and it doesn't matter if some of it is off broken plays. Tracy Ham may have had all sorts of run plays and calls that gave him the option to take-off, and he did pass way more than he carried the ball, but his scrambling and running ability made him a very good and successful CFL QB. Russ Jackson, Doug Flutie, Damon Allen were all obviously not just running QBs, but that skill helped make them even better than their fine passing arms alone allowed; same deal with Nathan Rourke (one of the top running QBs in all of US college ball in his days there), Chad Kelly or Cody Fajardo in the CFL now (Davis Alexander sort of too, but has the nagging hamstring injury concern to limit him there)

Josh Allen is a bigger, thicker body QB vs. Tre Ford but he is also being chased by some bigger D-linemen and LBs compared to Ford and also playing on a much smaller, tighter playing surface; Ford is also plain way faster (wether you like that or not) and gets to motor on a much bigger playing surface. There are numerous other very mobile, run threat QBs playing in the NFL now. Teams don't just have to have one of those ability QBs, but to ignore or dismiss or be blind to what that type of QB can do for an offence = i don't get it ??? Groovy though, if you believe pure pocket passing QBs are better and preferable

QBs could get injured by choosing to run; just like all sorts of more immobile QBs get injured just sitting in the pocket.

Pretty simple concepts, but disagree all you like.

I'm not arguing against the advantages of a mobile QB at all, but the QBs you mentioned could/can make enough plays from the pocket. Ford can't. No matter how mobile a QB is, that's not enough to win consistently.

[OV Argo]

Nope; agreed; not running basic, simple CFL offence of today.

Danny McManus or Tom Brady would likely have been no goode at running a roll-out, lots of real RPO and QB designed run play offence - I'm guessing. And a HC or OC who thought they could would be a moron.

[ArgoRavi]

Nope; agreed; not running basic, simple CFL offence of today.

Danny McManus or Tom Brady would likely have been no goode at running a roll-out, lots of real RPO and QB designed run play offence - I'm guessing. And a HC or OC who thought they could would be a moron.

Do you want Ford running on every play, OV? Do you want him rolling out on every play - thus cutting the field in half? Do you not want him in the pocket at all?

[OV Argo]

Nope; agreed; not running basic, simple CFL offence of today.

Danny McManus or Tom Brady would likely have been no goode at running a roll-out, lots of real RPO and QB designed run play offence - I'm guessing. And a HC or OC who thought they could would be a moron.

Do you want Ford running on every play, OV? Do you want him rolling out on every play - thus cutting the field in half? Do you not want him in the pocket at all?

I'm guessing you saw Tracy Ham play in the CFL? How did he do in the Argos all-pass run & shoot offence? vs. how did he do with offences that were designed to his best strength (mobility / run threat) ? Ham was a decent passer, but that's about it.

That type of QB would need a diverse offence, and that does not mean the guy rolls out and runs every second play. You combine that with plenty of ground game (smart teams use 2 RBs for diversity), a tight end or fullback involved some or lots, AND giving that type of QB a green light or designed run calls at strategic times, AND, this sets up the passing game for diverse plays there too - a mix of short, intermediate and deep shots.

Not going to happen in the same old, homogenous look CFL offences of today. But if that type of QB comes along, and the HC & OC are sold on that type of QB as their starter - they would be wise to design an O and play-call for that style QB; and be morons to think that type of QB could run standard, simple, lots of check down, little ground game, of today's CFL. UNLESS that type of skill-set QB also happened to be an outstanding passer as well (and those types are ultra rare IMO- Russ Jackson or Doug Flutie as the best examples)

[gilthethrill]

It has been reported that QB Bo Levi Mitchell is returning to Hamilton for the 2027 season in an effort to end the teams now 27 YEAR GREY CUP DROUGHT. Apparently he is a pending FA but a contract extension is a mere formality. I wish this was the same situation with Kelly & the Argos. Knowing Hamilton has a bonifide QB for next season should motivate the team to have one as well.

[Scooter McCray]

There is no reason the Argos should not be extending Chad. He is an elite CFL QB and gives the team a chance to win every game. The only reason not to would be ownership does not want to, but there is cost certainty because of salary cap. And if Rogers does want to sell team, why would you sell team without Kelly on it? Makes no sense.

[AngeloV]

There is no reason the Argos should not be extending Chad. He is an elite CFL QB and gives the team a chance to win every game. The only reason not to would be ownership does not want to, but there is cost certainty because of salary cap. And if Rogers does want to sell team, why would you sell team without Kelly on it? Makes no sense.

The only reason not to is the uncertainty of the 2028 salary cap. Especially if he wants a multi year deal. They will agree on a one year deal and then extend once they know the 2028 cap. At least that’s my belief.